Instance naming convention in TVPaint vs Harmony

[David_Fine]

So I know how instances work in terms of naming, but a friend of mine who is using TVPaint, but has used Harmony before, is baffled by the way the exposure sheet works. I have never used Harmony, so I don't have this perspective, but what she says makes sense to me.

In Harmony, when you create an instance, it is auto named and that name is locked. In TVPaint, an instance is auto named and when you move it to somewhere else on the timeline, it changes it's name! Why would that happen?

In Harmony, when you copy and paste an instance, you are copying the exact instance. They are the same artwork just as though you had reused the same physical animation drawing. They have the same name always because they are the same. You draw on one of them, it appears anywhere else in the timeline where that same drawing is. In TVPaint, you copy and paste a drawing and both will have different names (which are not locked) and updating one does not update the other. You can achieve the same by using Tracker and making sure the instances have the same name, but in Harmony, it just happens all by itself, so far easier. In Harmony, you can paste a drawing, rename it and then make it different if you choose that, but the main default idea is that copying an instance is actually just reusing the same piece of artwork, just as you would if the artwork was a physical drawing.

There was obviously a conscious decision to do things this way in TV Paint so I wonder if someone can explain the reason for that and why it's better than how Harmony does it, which, to me, seems like the more natural and logical way to treat instances.

[Elodie]

Thank you David for this interesting feedback.

There was obviously a conscious decision to do things this way in TV Paint so I wonder if someone can explain the reason for that and why it's better than how Harmony does it, which, to me, seems like the more natural and logical way to treat instances.

Well, in the matter of facts it's a mix of different events and contexts.

TVPaint's actual engine is from early 90's and was developed by a single person until 1996 / 1997.
From 1996 to 2005, TVPaint engine was developed for Newtek and then Bauhaus Software as a sort of VFX / editing software. During 9 years, we missed real animation needs.
In 2006, we were free from distributors and we decided to focus back on drawing and animation (which was the original motto of TVPaint's creator).

Meanwhile, Toonboom was funded and they bought their knowledge from USAnimation, PegsCo and Cambridge Animation System. When half of the job is already done, it's easier to improve it

Back to the timeline :
For TVPaint, the timeline was originally created for a while and even if it evolved a lot since, there is a kind of deep core we can hardly change now (timeline is not the only one btw.)
If you allow me a metaphor, it's like changing tubes and pipes in an old house's base : it takes lots of time and you're never really sure whether the house will remain steady or if it will collapse. I will go on allegories : it's sometimes faster and easier for everyone to smash the house and re-build it

I don't know how it's done in Harmony but as a vector-based software I assume the timeline is actually made of dependencies and actual drawings are "saved" in some other place (I'm talking about development code, not the UI). That would explain why when you create an instance, you create an element (a drawing) with kind of unique ID. So when you duplicate the instance and change its content, the changes are applied everywhere. (It's only a supposition of course : I've never stuck my nose in Harmony's code ).

In TVPaint, each drawing / instance is unique. We added some tricks with features like "name instance" or "tracker", but it's just a bypass solution.
Indeed, in the future we should propose something better.

[2dbert]

Actually the X-sheet (in version 10 at least) works the way you describe the Harmony X-sheet, unless I miss something (I don't know Harmony myself). I get the impression the X-sheet isn't awfully popular with most people, but I think depending on the project it can be more suitable, and to be able to switch between timeline and x-sheet function is quite handy.

[Elodie]

I've never used Harmony's XSheet (my only experience with Harmony is from 2007 as a "click and paint" trainee for TV series ) so I cannot compare.
But yes, the method I described is how the actual XSheet in TVPaint works. And I agree with you : few years ago when I understood how the XSheet worked, I found it quite useful, but it was "not enough".

It is not popular for several reasons (clutter interface, many missing tools, you cannot use group of layers, you cannot draw, etc.). Plus, it is not easy to understand, since you have a timeline where you can draw and a XSheet where you use dependencies.
This feature is like an "unachieved" stuff : good concept, limited conception. Hopefully in the future we can merge both ideas (drawing and using dependencies within the same working space).

[Fabrice]

... seems like the more natural and logical way to treat instances.

not for everyone, but I understand your point.
On our side, all options/possibilities should be remain (or become) available.

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For those who read this topic, please note that there are those options in the timeline & handy panel that might help you to achieve some change in the timline (renaming all frames at once + changing all the images having the same name)