Some Custom Brush improvements

[juansolimar]

hi, i was thinking, it would be great if each setting of the custom brush (size, shift, opacity, jitter, etc) has a lock icon on the side, so, when you change your custom brush, maintain the selected settings.

and another button to update the current brush, to save the new settings in the same custom brush (in case has change on some settings).

[Elodie]

Hello !

I'm not sure to understand the first idea with locks, since when you change a parameter, it won't affect other ones.

Regarding the update, it kind of exists : in cut brush tool options, you can check "keep" option, so the next brush cut will keep the same settings a the previous one.

[juansolimar]

i mean like this:

http://imgur.com/a/qbPN2" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


so when you keep lock one of those properties and you change your custom brush, dont change the locked propietie (if have one lock for each propertie, you have more control in wich aspect do you want to maintain).

and about the "update" button, what i mean is: when you already have a custom brush and you want to change some parameters and save it in the same brush, how you can do that? i dont mean to "keep" those properties for the next custom brush you can create. i mean update the already existing.

[Elodie]

i mean like this:
Image
http://imgur.com/a/qbPN2" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

so when you keep lock one of those properties and you change your custom brush, dont change the locked propietie (if have one lock for each propertie, you have more control in wich aspect do you want to maintain).

(For your information, you can upload images directly with the forum engine )

Ok for the lock, that's actually what I understood.
Basically, if you don't want to modify a setting, just don't touch it. A lock is usually necessary either to keep the ratio when you resize an object or - in the case of a layer - avoid the mistake to paint on the wrong element.
If we had to add locks on Brush settings, why not on every other settings in TVPaint ? I know, that would be terribly cumbersome, I just want to understand what would justify lock on brush settings and not, for instance, on FX ?

My concern it to get the purpose of such locks. Is it because you don't want people to modify the settings ? If so, a Lock won't stop them any longer, for they will just have to unlock a parameter.

and about the "update" button, what i mean is: when you already have a custom brush and you want to change some parameters and save it in the same brush, how you can do that? i dont mean to "keep" those properties for the next custom brush you can create. i mean update the already existing.

Right click on the brush saved in a custom panel : Grab current tool, keep icon

grab-current-keep-icon.png (6.74 KiB) Viewed 29427 times

[juansolimar]

Basically, if you don't want to modify a setting, just don't touch it. A lock is usually necessary either to keep the ratio when you resize an object or - in the case of a layer - avoid the mistake to paint on the wrong element.

but when you change your brush, your settings would change too
let me try to explain better:

if you change your custom brush, all the settings will change to the new brush, rigth?

what if i want to maintain some atribute from a brush to use it with another brush?

for example:

you have some custom brush saved in a size of 20 and a step of 12. and you have several similar brushes that you create with the same or pretty similar characteristic.
but... then you work in a bigger project, and the size 20 wont work anymore, and you change it to 40, but you need to adjust the step to maintain the brushtile. ok, done but when i change to another similar brush, i will return to size 20 and step 12.
one solution would be create a whole new brushes with those new characteristic, but this would take several time, and the constant change of needing would never end, so create a complete custom brushes for each sittuation wont be efficient.

if you can HOLD some settings for your custom brush, so, when you change your custom brush only would change the non hold ones, you can "adapt" any brush to those specefics settings that you know you need in that set.

btw

Right click on the brush saved in a custom panel : Grab current tool, keep icon

thanks!

[Elodie]

Ok, I understand better.

But in your example, why wouldn't you simply grab the brush with size 20 and step 2 in custom panel, then save the second version with size 40 an step 4 (which is not necessary btw : the step is a value in % that depends on the size, so the distance between two stamps will be constant (always n% of the size)).
So, it is more comfortable to switch between the brushes with the good parameters.

Or did I miss something ? Sorry if my questions seem dumb, I'm sincerely trying to understand what you want.

[juansolimar]

the example is simple and only ilustrative, and you can resolve as you said, but what if the sittuation is more complex? and even in the same example, i have to constant create new brushes.

another example:
you create 25 "dry brush" style. all works with similar parametters (because the principal difference are the brush animation itself).
and you are working in a bigger project, and the parameteres dont fit, you have to recreate all the 25 brush again! if you can hold some parameters, you can create a new brush (only one) with the new parameters that you know you need, and then (holding the specefics parameters that you need) swich beetween all the 25 brushes, readapting to the new needs.

with the parameters i have to add the mode "color - alpha stamp - alpha max stamp - luma stamp... etc" (the ones unique of the custom brush, im not talking about color, behind, erase. those change easily with f2-f3-f4,etc)


lets see another example to see if its more clear what i mean:

you have 10 "texture line brush" in mode color, and opacity on 100. and you have a black texture line as result. but then you need to change the color, you have to change the mode from color to alpha stamp, but the 100 opacity wont work well, because its to high and you lose some texture detail, (in 100 work fine with "color" because the brush is already black), and you need to down opacity to 50 for example. when you change to another of those 10 "texture line brush", you have to change from color to alpha stamp and opacity from 100 to 50 every time you change your brush. if you have a HOLD option for those, i can change my brush with the new (but momentary) need settings (alpha stamp and 50 opacity). withouth have to create or modify any brush.

with a hold option, any brush can easily convert in a mixer for example (holding 0 opacity, smear mode and adding shift). but only momentary. once i take of the "hold" options, i can easily get back to my original brush.

[Elodie]

another example:
you create 25 "dry brush" style. all works with similar parametters (because the principal difference are the brush animation itself).
and you are working in a bigger project, and the parameteres dont fit, you have to recreate all the 25 brush again! if you can hold some parameters, you can create a new brush (only one) with the new parameters that you know you need, and then (holding the specefics parameters that you need) swich beetween all the 25 brushes, readapting to the new needs.

with the parameters i have to add the mode "color - alpha stamp - alpha max stamp - luma stamp... etc" (the ones unique of the custom brush, im not talking about color, behind, erase. those change easily with f2-f3-f4,etc)

In that typical case, I would simply use "keep" option when you cut a brush. That's actually what I do when I create custom brushes

lets see another example to see if its more clear what i mean:

you have 10 "texture line brush" in mode color, and opacity on 100. and you have a black texture line as result. but then you need to change the color, you have to change the mode from color to alpha stamp, but the 100 opacity wont work well, because its to high and you lose some texture detail, (in 100 work fine with "color" because the brush is already black), and you need to down opacity to 50 for example. when you change to another of those 10 "texture line brush", you have to change from color to alpha stamp and opacity from 100 to 50 every time you change your brush. if you have a HOLD option for those, i can change my brush with the new (but momentary) need settings (alpha stamp and 50 opacity). withouth have to create or modify any brush.

with a hold option, any brush can easily convert in a mixer for example (holding 0 opacity, smear mode and adding shift). but only momentary. once i take of the "hold" options, i can easily get back to my original brush.

This example works better and I think I'm starting to get the point (yeah!)

But, usually, brushes are grabbed in custom panels because they must be used with these or those parameters. With locks, I would be afraid of mistakes during productions : someone would activate a lock and keep a "bad" parameter active on every brushes (which would ruin inking, for instance).
Plus, some parameters (like smear) depend on the stamp mode : if you lock "smear" parameters but then, your next brush is in Alpha stamp, what would happen ?

And finally, the lock would work only between brushes of "the same species" : custom brushes with custom brushes / pen brushes with pen brushes / mechanical pencil with mechanical pencil, etc.
So if you lock the size on a Pen Brush, then use a Custom brush, the size won't be locked, for in the code they are considered as 2 different parameters (since they do not belong to the same tool).

I wonder what other people in the forum think about it. Any other thoughts ?

[slowtiger]

I think I'm against locks. I've watched my students using TVP, and myself, and noticed we all tend to start from an established brush and tweak it ever so often during painting. If the brush gets altered too much, there's always just one click into the panel to get it back. If a certain setting works well, it's just a click in the bin to save it.

[Fabrice]

Interesting discussion for the future developments.

[juansolimar]

And finally, the lock would work only between brushes of "the same species" : custom brushes with custom brushes / pen brushes with pen brushes / mechanical pencil with mechanical pencil, etc.
So if you lock the size on a Pen Brush, then use a Custom brush, the size won't be locked, for in the code they are considered as 2 different parameters (since they do not belong to the same tool).

im suggesting the hold/lock option only for custom brush.

now its more clear what i mean. and its just that, a suggestion. some users may feel more lost with this, and i understand that.

[Fabrice]

and its just that, a suggestion

it can't be done in the current engine, but later maybe. We keep track of this suggestion.