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Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 08 May 2014, 13:54
by Mads Juul
Paul Fierlinger wrote:"Please change the wording" is one thing, and "Our intern just lost a lot of work because of YOU" is another.
I agree.

In My own experience it is for some reason it is very easy to get mad when writing on the internet I experience some kind of "road rage" .
I guess this is not uncommon. I found this from a quick search (Only read the start though)
http://www.scientificamerican.com/artic ... -so-angry/

so let's keep the conversations in a positive atmosphere

And try to keep the focus of the threads. And this is the localization of the Project save. which hasn't changed yet. As the TVpaint Developers have mentioned was their intention :)

Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 08 May 2014, 14:00
by Lukas
Of course it's our fault if we answer YES to a question that asks if we want to close without saving. But that's just not the point here... Again, look at the image. Photoshop and Word do a better job than TVPaint at asking the question.

No hard feelings. Mads is right about my internet road rage. I don't mean to be an ass, I'm just trying to prove a point. :)

I do like animating in TVPaint... (Watch me goooo live https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wd-uVoc_TAw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; )

Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 08 May 2014, 14:06
by Mads Juul
Lukas wrote: No hard feelings. Mads is right about my internet road rage. I don't mean to be an ass, I'm just trying to prove a point. :)
And the point was actually proven before 27 august 2013. :D
So now the topic is about remebering the developers to implement this.
I am (as you )looking forward to the change in localization

Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 08 May 2014, 14:23
by Mads Juul
Lukas wrote: I do like animating in TVPaint... (Watch me goooo live https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wd-uVoc_TAw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; )
Looks nice. is it a live broadcast? Why?
Which one is your Workstation?

Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 08 May 2014, 14:25
by Lukas
madsjuul wrote:
Lukas wrote: I do like animating in TVPaint... (Watch me goooo live https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wd-uVoc_TAw" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; )
Looks nice. is it a live broadcast? Why?
Which one is your Workstation?
It's live with a 10 second delay. You can submit story endings here: http://www.storychangers.eu" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; and we animate them.

I'm the guy with long hair, standing :)

This is one of the endings I did yesterday. so much fun to do: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtPp3h8LhGg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 08 May 2014, 14:35
by Mads Juul
Lukas wrote: This is one of the endings I did yesterday. so much fun to do: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtPp3h8LhGg" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Nice!

Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 09 May 2014, 05:20
by Elodie
Sorry for the late answer, but yesterday was a holdiay.
The localisation was changed : it is not "do you want really" but "do you really want"

That's what we understood last year and we listened to you. :|
I'll check this one later (i'm currently on the bus, using m'y phone).

Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 09 May 2014, 06:16
by Elodie
Ok, check : the alert you have when you quit TVPaint hasn't changed.

I add in our to do list.

BTW, Joost, Joonas, you must understand the difference between this panel :

Image

and this one :

Image

The first one is when you quit TVPaint. The second is only when you close the project, without quitting TVPaint.

But ok, in other software, you only have the first panel, whatever if you quit the software or close the current "project".

I "to do list" this request too.
madsjuul wrote:In My own experience it is for some reason it is very easy to get mad when writing on the internet I experience some kind of "road rage" .
I guess this is not uncommon. I found this from a quick search (Only read the start though)
http://www.scientificamerican.com/artic ... -so-angry/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Because most of the time, people don't realize that what they wrote is read by another human. Plus, with facebook, twitter, instagram and all these "social" network, people become more and more selfish and only think about themselves, their needs, their feelings and their opinion, being less and less empathic and tolerant (that's what I could read in another scientific study). Plus, because of the way people think, write, read and understand a text, there are many way to (mis)understand someone and so, everyone gets mad.

I understand Joost and Lukas frustration but don't forget the context :
• In August 2013, we released in advance TVPaint Animation 10.5 for forum's members only, as a reward for their activity on the forum. This version was finally terribly bugged and we spent several weeks to fix everything, the faster we could (while reading a rain of angry posts... :| ). Obviously, changing the alert window when you quit TVPaint was not our priority.
• Plus, we lost information between the "quitting" window and the "closing project" window, as Mads explained.
• Result : tadaaa, this bloody windows hasn't changed. :roll:

So, sorry, but you'll have to be more patient.

Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 09 May 2014, 06:51
by Mads Juul
Hi Elodie
Now i'm actually A little confused

You explain the difference between the two windows

Elodie wrote:
BTW, Joost, Joonas, you must understand the difference between this panel :

Image

and this one :

Image

The first one is when you quit TVPaint. The second is only when you close the project, without quitting TVPaint.
So You say that you havnt changed the first window when you Quit TVPaint
Elodie wrote:Ok, check : the alert you have when you quit TVPaint hasn't changed.
But it is the Second window Lucas and Joost want to change
http://forum.tvpaint.com/viewtopic.php? ... 743#p60381
http://forum.tvpaint.com/viewtopic.php? ... =15#p73422


So now Im talking about the Second window "Closing a project without quitting TVP", which I also finds confusing.

The popup says "The document is not saved. Do You really want to close it? Yes/No"

I think the problem is the question is about should I CLOSE the project( witout saving or stay).
But I think it would be better if the question should be should I SAVE (or just close without saving)
Something like "Save Changes to this Project ? |Yes|No|Cancel"

In the list made by Lukas it seems like this is the way the other software put their question
http://www.lukaskrepel.nl/temp/TVP/quittingTVP.png
On exit the other software's ask if you should SAVE. Not if you should CLOSE as TVPaint does and I think this is whu I find the question confusing.

Does this makes sense or am I missing something?
-Mads

Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 09 May 2014, 06:59
by Elodie
Mads wrote:So You say that you havnt changed the first window when you Quit TVPaint
Correct.

And I added :
Elodie wrote:Ok, check : the alert you have when you quit TVPaint hasn't changed.

I add in our to do list.
Which means, "ok, we will change Save & Quit / Quit / Cancel" for "Don't save / Cancel / Save", as Joost, Lukas and you asked a year ago.
Mads wrote:But it is the Second window Lucas and Joost want to change
Yes, I know.
My answers were :
Elodie wrote:The localisation was changed : it is not "do you want really" but "do you really want"

That's what we understood last year and we listened to you. :|
+
Elodie wrote:The first one is when you quit TVPaint. The second is only when you close the project, without quitting TVPaint.

But ok, in other software, you only have the first panel, whatever if you quit the software or close the current "project".

I "to do list" this request too.
Which means :
We will replace "Do you really want to close ? Y / N" by "Don't save / Cancel / Save"

Elodie wrote:Plus, because of the way people think, write, read and understand a text, there are many way to (mis)understand someone and so, everyone gets mad.
:wink:

Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 09 May 2014, 07:29
by Mads Juul
Elodie wrote: We will replace "Do you really want to close ? Y / N" by "Don't save / Cancel / Save"
Shouldn't there be a question?

So You replace with something like
"Do you want to save changes made to the project ? Don't save / Cancel / Save"

-Mads

Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 09 May 2014, 08:18
by Elodie
Yes indeed, even if it looks like people don't read sentences but just click following their habits :roll: :mrgreen:

Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 09 May 2014, 08:25
by Mads Juul
Sounds good :D

Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 09 May 2014, 08:33
by Lukas
Thanks guys! : )

Re: When quitting TVP

Posted: 09 May 2014, 14:10
by Peter Wassink
Image
{/quote]
i think this can be improved further with a better(safer) grouping of the buttons, under the Quit/Close statement.
so not the current:
Save And Quit----Quit-------------------------Cancel
because this offers the two safe options on both sides of the "dangerous one" in the middle.
and the save option is uncomfortably close to quit, a miss click really is conceivable.
i'd prefer to have the save options on the right, and the unsafe option on the left with some distance between.
like this:
Quit-------------------------Save And Quit----Cancel
and for projects the same:
Close ---------------------Save And Close-----Cancel