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Elodie wrote:This pop-up appears only if you don't do anything during several seconds (once the limited time is over, of course), in order to avoid the case where "you draw and animate and PAF ! a pop-up". No, no, it waits that you do nothing during few seconds.

I see... Perhaps I was evaluating my drawing or doing a multitask, like quickly reading an email that I just received or something, and this thing popped up, I just didn't like it.

Elodie wrote:But, there is something I don't get : you complain about that pop-up, but what if the auto-save was working ? It would save automatically and you would lose the original part of your work.

That is exactly how it worked in this latest version because of that bug, that you couldn't snooze or cancel the message and were forced to save over your file. But the way I see an autosave is that it won't save over anything you're working on, but periodically save your current file in another folder, one that was appointed by the user, and with another name. For example your current filename with a timestamp behind it.

And I am not complaining, Elodie. I am just letting you know how I experienced this new feature and where I believe it can be improved. These are just my experiences and opinions and I am not expecting TVP to change this feature on the fly because of my comments. Hopefully it will help the developers think more thoroughly about how we use the software. And if enough users agree with me, it might possibly be adjusted. Or perhaps someone will have better suggestion.

Like I said; I was under the impression that that is the intent of this thread.

Sewie wrote:And I am not complaining, Elodie. I am just letting you know how I experienced this new feature and where I believe it can be improved. These are just my experiences and opinions and I am not expecting TVP to change this feature on the fly because of my comments. Hopefully it will help the developers think more thoroughly about how we use the software. And if enough users agree with me, it might possibly be adjusted. Or perhaps someone will have better suggestion.

Ok, thank you for explaining me your point of view :]

Elodie wrote:

Lukas wrote:The "Save Alarm" is...well, stupid.

Thank you, we like to read how stupid we are.

Sorry Elodie, I had no intent of insulting anyone. But it's really nothing to take personal, I was only trying to think of solutions that would work better.

Elodie wrote:But, there is something I don't get : you complain about that pop-up, but what if the auto-save was working ? It would save automatically and you would lose the original part of your work.

Of course, auto-save should NEVER over-write what you've saved. That would only make the chance of losing work even bigger.

There's many software that have auto-saves that are not intrusive or annoying at all. (look at: Adobe Premiere, or Anime Studio Pro, it's impossible to lose work with the way they do it)

Sewie wrote:And I am not complaining, Elodie. I am just letting you know how I experienced this new feature and where I believe it can be improved. These are just my experiences and opinions and I am not expecting TVP to change this feature on the fly because of my comments. Hopefully it will help the developers think more thoroughly about how we use the software. And if enough users agree with me, it might possibly be adjusted. Or perhaps someone will have better suggestion.

Sewie has a better way with words
I definitely agree with what he's saying.

Lukas wrote:Sorry Elodie, I had no intent of insulting anyone. But it's really nothing to take personal, I was only trying to think of solutions that would work better.

Ok, I understand you didn't want to be mean.
But yes, of course we take this personally. TVPaint is our baby and as good mothers and fathers we are, we don't appreciate when people mock it
(sorry for the metaphor, I hope you'll understand what I mean )

Lukas wrote:(look at: Adobe Premiere, or Anime Studio Pro, it's impossible to lose work with the way they do it)

Hmm, ok, but in a way, for Adobe Premiere, it's easier, as it only uses links to an existing file, which is not he case of TVPaint : when your project longs 5 minutes, of drawing inside your TVPaint files, not links.
Concerning ASP, I've never used it, but I suppose that as a vectorial software, its files are lighter than if they were in bitmap.

I understand your needs and your reasons, but I would fear a lack of stability with such a feature. And we all know how angry you are when the software is instable
(sorry, I'm joking ! )

Elodie wrote:But, there is something I don't get : you complain about that pop-up, but what if the auto-save was working ? It would save automatically and you would lose the original part of your work.

I think the talk is more about temporary files backups - not saving over the working file. Most software works like this these days.

Elodie wrote:Hmm, ok, but in a way, for Adobe Premiere, it's easier, as it only uses links to an existing file, which is not he case of TVPaint : when your project longs 5 minutes, of drawing inside your TVPaint files, not links.
Concerning ASP, I've never used it, but I suppose that as a vectorial software, its files are lighter than if they were in bitmap.

Photoshop is an example of a bitmap software, able to work with massive files and keeping a recovery backup saving in the background without affecting the workflow at all. I am not advocating Adobe here, just letting you know it can work.

Elodie wrote:I understand your needs and your reasons, but I would fear a lack of stability with such a feature. And we all know how angry you are when the software is instable
(sorry, I'm joking ! )

I agree here that TVP is very stable comparing to other software - maybe it's due to lack of some features too. But if that issue could be solved without loosing the stability, it would be incredible.

As for now, I think instead of the alarm clock, a visible indication, like an asterix next to the name, or changing color of the project name tab could be a better indication that the file is not saved. It would be visible enough for a user to decide if to save it or not without intruding his field of view with pop-ups

Soom wrote: Photoshop is an example of a bitmap software, able to work with massive files and keeping a recovery backup saving in the background without affecting the workflow at all. I am not advocating Adobe here, just letting you know it can work.

Yes, that's what I am advocating also -- not so much reminding people to save, but to fix a file in the case of a crash (OS crash or application crash, power goes out, etc). That way if there are incremental backups done outside of the main file, on a periodic basis, if a crash occurs, some data can be recovered by comparing those temp backups to the main file (as I described earlier). There are open source apps like Ardour and kdenlive that do this quite well.

Soom wrote: As for now, I think instead of the alarm clock, a visible indication, like an asterix next to the name, or changing color of the project name tab could be a better indication that the file is not saved. It would be visible enough for a user to decide if to save it or not without intruding his field of view with pop-ups

Ok, it's noted.

I also note your strong desire of auto-backup. But don't wait for it in the coming weeks. We only have 4 developers and all of them are already working on many other complex stuff

Elodie wrote: Ok, it's noted.
I also note your strong desire of auto-backup. But don't wait for it in the coming weeks. We only have 4 developers and all of them are already working on many other complex stuff

You are doing a great job no doubt, but this is just something to keep in mind for future especially when more and more studios and individual animators are relying on TVP for their daily work

I'm still not very comfortable with the save-alarm because it wants to overwrite the current file all the time.

Maybe an incremental save button or something could be good?

Lukas wrote:I'm still not very comfortable with the save-alarm because it wants to overwrite the current file all the time.

Maybe an incremental save button or something could be good?

Something like Preferences/Multi-Backup?

Svengali wrote:

Lukas wrote:I'm still not very comfortable with the save-alarm because it wants to overwrite the current file all the time.

Maybe an incremental save button or something could be good?

Something like Preferences/Multi-Backup?

I never used it because of the strange files it created. I never read the instructions, thanks!

+1
Yes to : "Save incremental" with save alarm, or "Save as.."